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  1. SuperTweety
  2. Supergirl General Discussion
  3. Wednesday, 02 January 2019
I know the season started with suggesting that the Colonel wasn't someone to be trusted, but to be honest I kind of like her character...what we've seen so far...and hope that she isn't the baddie they hinted she was at the beginning.

What do you guys think?
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It would be a very dull and boring world if we were all the same, and thought the same way too, so I'm really enjoying the diversity of ideas being expressed on this particular topic.

I don't think that asking Supergirl to reveal her secret identity was the President's idea. When he was asking her to do that, Col. Haley was standing behind him with what I thought was a very smug look on her face. And then, when Supergirl told the President that she couldn't give him what he was asking for, he didn't get upset or all bent out of shape about it; he accepted her decision calmly, thanked her for her service, dismissed her, and then left it at that. But if you remember the look on Haley's face seconds later, it was one of frustration and maybe even some anger.

As for Haley's obsession with discovering who Supergirl is; I get the impression that she has ignored the President's acceptance of Supergirl's decision and gone behind his back on this one and that he doesn't know that she's doing it. And, for someone who'd like nothing better than for Supergirl to stay out of her way, Haley's statement to Super-Kara that she's going to inform the President so that she can have him recruit Supergirl back into the DEO suggests that it's all about that control-freak mentality that she has about getting everyone around her to do exactly what she orders them to do, to her own ends, whatever they may be. Haley must have a back-story, as many characters do, but so far, nothing that she's done has given me the impression that she's somehow going to end up on the good side of whatever is coming.

As for being redeemable? Max Lord was redeemed in the end, and although he and Super/Kara were never going to be best buds, he turned out to be not nearly as much of an enemy for her in the end, and has in fact kept her secret for the past three years. And General Lane - as noted below - also realized that Supergirl is one of the good guys too. As a matter of fact, even though we haven't seen either of these two characters since the end of Season One, I'd love to see the General show up, and even kick Haley's ass all the way back to Washington. Not likely to happen, I know, but it's fun to fantasize about.
(And on a completely different aside; with Lois and Clark engaged to be married soon, is there any chance that Sam and Lucy Lane would reappear, even if just for the wedding? Unless Lois and Clark decide to elope.)

So, as they used to say when I was a kid, that's my 2 cents worth. Over to the next writer.
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Redeemable for me is someone who is able to be changed, someone who sees the error in his/her way and therefore, is saved in some way. It's not the same as expecting someone to now be made good or ignoring everything that they did that was bad. And, I think that is kind of what Supergirl is about. Forgiveness is a very hard pill to swallow at times but, it is made a little easier if we can understand more about the character - if there might be some reason behind their actions that we, as an audience, can say, yeah, I can see why they might have thought the way they did. With Colonel Haley, we really haven't really gotten any of that so far. She has been shown as very one-dimensional. We haven't seen a backstory. Even Lockwood has had more of a backstory presented and no, I still don't like him even if I can see where he developed the attitude because he hasn't changed, hasn't evolved his thinking.

It kind of reminds me of Waco and Koresh. Before watching the movie, I had all these negative beliefs about him and the adult followers who were inside of the compound. While I watched it, I actually started to have a little bit of understanding and even some sympathy for Koresh. By the end, I still hated some of the things that Koresh did that put everyone in the situation in the first place but, I also had a bit of empathy for him and a lot for everyone else that was in there. He wasn't completely redeemed in my eyes but, it did change my earlier perception of him.

With General Lane, I didn't like him for most of the season because he, too, was written one dimensional. When he came into the DEO and took it over, by-passing Alex, I hated him. If it wasn't for the very end of the season, when they finally added some layers to him with Lucy, he wouldn't have been a character I could have liked at all. Even then, I still wasn't fond of him because I didn't trust what he would do in the future - but, we didn't get to explore that because he was dropped from the show.

Haley's backstory is going to have to be very compelling in order for me to think that she can be redeemed. But, with the direction the show has typically gone regarding these types of characters, I wouldn't be surprised if they don't make an effort to do that.
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I may be being harsh but to me there's no way Col Haley is redeemable. Not even if she sacrifices herself to save Kara to me that would be justice not redemption. I don't care what trauma you've been through what kind of person threatens someone who seconds ago saved your life. What kind of person traumatizes children to turn them into weapons. Even General Lane wound up respecting Supergirl. He got points from me when his response to Supergirl telling him about Myriad was to ask about Lucy. For the same reason I don't think Ben or Lydia Lockwood are redeemable. Supergirl saved Lydia and minutes later he started the whole secret identity thing. If Ben hadn't started it the President would've has made his demand and Col. Haley wouldn't have gone on her crusade. And Lydia far from being grateful is taking up his anti-alien stance. Baseline for being a good person is if someone saves your life or the life of someone you love don't turn on them.

The only one that to me has a chance at redemption is Manchester Black. IMO he's did the right thing but went about it the wrong way. He should pay for his crimes but perhaps he can learn from his mistakes.
Hope, Help and Compassion for all
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I totally agree with you, Sully. It has almost seemed totally odd that President Mars would choose someone so 100% opposite her views. Though, I could see how her hiding from home the fact that she was an alien, could anger him. He just seems to have made a 180 since talking with Supergirl after his inauguration. At that time, he didn't seem angry with aliens, even after having just found out about the President. Hmmmm.
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Hey Richard. Nice to see you in here posting. It's great to have others contributing ideas to get the ole' minds a crankin'.

You may be right about the president. He could just be in it to improve his ratings or he could be a puppet for someone else (**cough, Lex). He hasn't been shown enough for me to get a good feel for him. I would just find it a bit odd though that President Marsdin would have chosen a running mate who had anti-alien views. So, either she didn't know him very well or he has changed his agenda based on some external force.

I have been trying to stay positive on Colonel Haley and I still think that there might be a way to salvage the character. She mentioned to Alex that sometimes people have to do what they don't want to because they think it's for the benefit of the better good. That kind of told me that she wasn't proud of what she did with the Morai but, felt that she didn't have a choice in the matter. I still go back to the idea that the Colonel is strongly tied to the military and their rank & file way of doing things. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that she had some type of military regime tied into her formative years in some way. With the whole nature versus nurture theme going on this season, it wouldn't be a stretch to have there be a tie-in with Haley, too. That those experiences shaped her views and how she approaches a situation. But, if nature is also important and she actually has some noble characteristics, perhaps she can be persuaded to change her outlook once she is given more information on those experiences and beliefs. But, yeah, right now I kind of hate her so, whatever redemption arc she might get, had best be a good one.
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I don't contribute to the Forum very often, but I've always enjoyed the exchange of ideas on it. It's too easy to get into arguments about different things, so I find that the respectful sharing of different ideas here is a much better way to offer our various opinions on things to each other - again, a good reason to enjoy what members post here.

As for Colonel Haley and President Baker; I'm not sold on either of them being trustworthy at this point in the season. The President's actions may be motivated more on his previously-stated concerns over the drop in his public support, as shown by poll numbers, rather than because of any devious agenda. Time will tell.

As for Haley; I kept hoping that she would turn into a 'good guy' at some point, but given the threats that she threw in Supergirl's face only seconds after Supergirl had saved her, I suspect that she might have some kind of a personal agenda of her own, and that her clearly obsessive need to control everyone and everything around her is paramount to that end. Thus, being able to blackmail Supergirl into doing whatever Haley wants or needs her to do would be a way of achieving that agenda. Either way, they are both keeping everyone guessing, which is what good drama is supposed to be all about.

As the main purpose of the Forum is for members to exchange ideas, I hope that this might contribute another perspective to the mysteries around both Haley and the President.
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She seems like a heavy in the Amanda Waller mold, but I agree there may be more to her.
Most likely my comic ignorance is keeping me in the dark on this one. Not sure who Amanda Waller is to make the connection?

Amanda Waller is generally an antagonist to the DC heroes but sometimes an ally. In Arrow, she was the head of ARGUS and developed the Arrowverse version of the Suicide Squad. Her tactics may be viewed as morally questionable at best, but her ruthlessness produced results, and in her own mind, she is making the necessary decisions for national security.

Haley strikes me as cut from similar cloth, though not as overtly villainous. At least not yet.
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She seems like a heavy in the Amanda Waller mold, but I agree there may be more to her.
Most likely my comic ignorance is keeping me in the dark on this one. Not sure who Amanda Waller is to make the connection?

Perhaps that same bald head has something over the head of the current el presidente. Perhaps Lex positioned the Vice President to be put into power so the VP could then pardon Lex?
We're assuming that when Lex comes on the show that he will be out of prison and this could be a good possibility.

Or, his entire appearance is with him behind bars, which is not really something that I'm hoping to see.
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I echo everything Sully just said.

And, I still find the new President's shift in behavior from the first convo we saw between him and Supergirl to his latest demands on her a bit odd.

I also haven't forgotten 1.) the fact that the siblings knew the outgoing President's true alien identity, as well as, 2) the scene of Liberty talking to someone on the phone in the car who seemed of importance. Starting to believe a certain bald headed and diabolical villian has been orchestrating things from behind bars. Perhaps that same bald head has something over the head of the current el presidente. Perhaps Lex positioned the Vice President to be put into power so the VP could then pardon Lex?
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From my perspective, the jury is still out regarding the President and the Colonel. I sure as heck don't trust either of them, but they may have good reasons for their actions. I am still trying to reconcile Baker's demeanor before and after he was sworn in. How Haley fits into that is unclear.

She seems like a heavy in the Amanda Waller mold, but I agree there may be more to her.
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Oh, OK - Colonel Haley!
When I first saw the caption, I thought maybe you were talking about this "other Colonel" - who has in fact appeared in DC Comics.
Here he is with Green Lantern:

https://www.dccomics.com/sites/default/files/imce/DC%20KFC%20%233%20Cover%20Art_596d55ac7de6d5.78317235.jpg
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I've said in other threads that I am hoping that the Colonel turns out to be on Kara's side. She's one of those characters who, even though she has said some things that might seem to be anti-Supergirl, I get the impression that it's not about Supergirl being an alien. Instead, I think that the Colonel's own backstory/experience with the rigidness and formality of the military causes her to rely on it to guide her approach to dealing with situations and gives an anti-Supergirl perception. But, I believe that she'll start to loosen up that approach once she figures out who the "bad" guys and "good" guys really are. Really, she reminds me a bit of an Alex who hasn't had an outsider like Kara to help teach her about life outside of the military box. I just have a gut-feeling I guess, that she is going to be used as an instrument to send the message that everyone has the power/choice to make a decision that helps the greater good and that positive change comes from those who are in positions to make that change.

Plus, I would also like to see the Colonel as an ally because there seems to be a lot of anti-government material being laid down this season and I think that it's important to show a balance of good, too, in that area - outside of our main characters of Alex and J'onn.
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Yeah, I think she may turn out to be more of an ally than an enemy, perhaps another gray character. The next episode may tell us a lot. Although she stated the new DEO policy on transparency with stern authority (as a good commander should), she did look a little shell-shocked when Supergirl was terminated. She also looked impressed when Alex stood up for herself in an earlier segment by declaring a willingness to follow her instincts even if it risked court martial. So I think there is more to the colonel than has been revealed so far.
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