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Hi,

I just found this article that I thought should be shared but with a caveat. As we all are aware by now, Supergirl's writing staff, various actors and showrunners tend to be more left-leaning in their views and it seems to make its way onto the TV screen usually in the guise of Cat Grant quips. As an informed SG viewer, do you believe that the show has tilted too much one way or another along the political / social commentary spectrum and if so, what exactly are the sticking points?

NOTE WELL: Since U.S. politics (and in general) is a very polarising issue at the current time, please be respectful when posting your opinion and allow others the same courtesy. No one needs to one-up another to prove a point. Civil discussion is possible as long as the house (i.e. the site's posting rules) policies are respected. Everyone is entitled to an opinion and posting privileges. Please be aware that opinions may vary, but in the end we're all fans of the same show and the same goal (namely, to enjoy Kara's journey into who she is supposed to be).

Any constructive thoughts or opinions?...
References
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Proud Progressive Feminist Social Justice Warrior....

Love it!

And add in what superbill said.... :p
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Honestly... As a conservative... I really wasn't really offended this episode. Yeah yeah... Jabs. But not TOO bad. I've still watched this epi 3 times already. So, I guess that's sayin somethin, as I didn't really do that at all 2nd season. 1st season I could almost quote every one, knew what songs went with what scenes, and knew the names of every epi. lol Hoping for that season 3. So far? Lookin good. Lookin good.
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Being Conservative - I do have a problem with the pot shots/insults. The claims made are insulting and the writers should not be pushing their agenda during the show. It is not good business to alienate potentially half of your viewers. For starters - to be so definite in their claim about climate change/global warming and then be so insulting if you disagree with the liberal position is disrespectful. Please note - I am not insulting anyone here - I want facts. There is more than enough statistical evidence to at least question the concept, if not totally debunk it - so the science is definitely not settled. Al Gore famously claimed that the polar ice caps would be gone by now - and they are still around and even growing. The "97% consensus among scientists" claim is just a fancy way of saying it is their opinion. Science is not about consensus - it is about FACT. Even from all the coverage about hurricanes lately, the best forecast can only be a few days out and they constantly refer to the "cone of uncertainty" because they do not know exactly what may happen or where the storm is going.. Just ask Jacksonville about what happened with IRMA. Tampa was supped to be hit but the storm turned against all predictions and went to the east instead of up the coast. EVERYBODY got that wrong. How can anyone seriously claim that they can accurately predict prolong weather changes or what may occur years from now? The one question that global warming "experts" can never answer is... if you are so sure of your facts and science- please tell me EXACTLY when and what will happen. No generalities. FACTS only. Tell me the location, the event(s) and the date of the occurrence(s). When you can do that and it can be PROVEN - I might be willing to listen. Go ....... Until these facts can be presented and proven - no one should be making the claims that the show is pushing. ... There are other issues but you can ponder this post for now.


jd can't say I blame you.
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This episode is still not available in the UK, but I have followed this discussion with interest. (You may not believe it, but politics in the uk is even more divisive!) George Orwell’s statement that “all issues are political issues, and politics itself is a mass of lies, evasions, folly, hatred and schizophrenia” rings especially true now!

I have in the past been critical of some of the writing in Supergirl (actually more in Series1 than Series 2). But I do feel a little for the writers sometimes. There are some views at the absolute opposite ends of the spectrum on issues such as the various relationships (real or imagined); sexuality; immigration; feminism; how far the show should deviate from the comics tradition or traditions, and of course politics.

Writers will never please everyone. Different people will find different fault lines in every single book, movie, TV show, etc. ever created. The only path creators can follow with any assurance is their own. If this offends people too much, they of course have the option to switch off. But then, in this case, they would miss an inspirational heroine and cracking team of actors telling an incredible story.

Party politics is, of its nature, designed to be divisive in the real world. It would be a great shame to let it be so in Neverland.
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A prominent example of the 4th wall politicking destroying the fictional plot is Cat's speech in last season's finale.

While urging to resist the Daxamites, it's obvious the whole speech makes them an allegory to Trump.

Except the Daxamites are nothing like Trump.

(From a negative view of Trump personally) Trump was elected by giving hope. Sounds weird I know. That wasn't a compliment for him. He offered illusory solutions to real problems, he promised to fix economic hardship for many. He was able to use immigrants etc as a scapegoat for real problems caused by failings elsewhere.

TLDR, Trump enticed people by promising to fix their problems. now obvious in my view and that of the liberals, he won't fix jack and is inciting racism etc, but the previous point stands.

The Daxamites are straight up alien invaders with nothing to do with earth. They offered nothing. They straight up occupied National City. They did not negotiate, they did not reason. They did not try to win the heart of the people.

One was an election campaign, the other an invasion.

So, when Cat started using the descriptions of Trump for the Daxamites, and saying things like they promise to make the world great again, ......what the #$%@%@?

There are shows intended to be political allegories. They work, because their settings reflect the problem they wish to talk about. It made sense, both externally and within the show itself. Supergirl isn't a political allegory show. When it tried allegory, it made no sense.
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Jdbop... Thanks for the great post. Lead me to edit my post so as not to get into deep political POLICIES, rather than simply discussing a desire for the writers to just equalize it a bit. They did once before... Gave Kara's stance on more liberal journalism while balancing it with Snapper's. They also did it once when Kara was all about open alien immigration while balancing it with some comments by Alex who reminded her not ALL aliens are "good" aliens. In the end, I remember Kara (after battling some evil that episode) did recognize she saw some wisdom in the opposing viewpoint.

But yeah... Jokes? Great. Talking down to...Not so much.
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Really this frequent 4th wall breaking grinds down the integrity of the fictional universe of E38
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evrafter's post just reminded me, a lot of these are indeed just shots at Republicans.

I don't like the Republicans, being socialist I'm as far from their position as can be, further than liberals, but the politics in this show frankly does not feel like championing the progressive cause, it feels like slaps being thrown in the bipartisan fistfight.

Having powerful women isn't politics, that's feminism (or if there's a better word). Having Sanvers isn't politics, that's inclusion. Hell, talking about climate change isn't politics, it's science and it's fact.

Constantly grinding on the speaker, President, etc, as much as they deserved to be derided for their views in reality, while constantly promoting the Democrats, that is politics and it is cringy to watch in a show where in-universe Trump and Clinton don't even hold their jobs.
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brierrose: I have no problems with Supergirl being a strong female character. I have no problem with the Barry Iris relationship, etc. Those are absolutely great story lines and not based on insults.
I think there is a great discussion to have about your mistaken premise about the current Admin and women's rights, legal immigration, etc. but this is not the location or time.

My point is simply the writers should tell good stories and alienate half of their audience.
Flash, Arrow, Legends do not resort to that. Supergirl should not need to do it either.
Like Michael Jordan said, "Republicans buy shoes too". Do not cause self inflicted wounds that hurt your business/audience. It really is a pretty simple lesson to learn that the writers do not seem to know on Supergirl.
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Edit: I decided to follow jdbop's lead, and edited out part of my comment below because I put too much political discussion in it. And jdbop was right... not the place. So I'll just leave the following:

For me, I've never had problems with the jokes. Now that you mention it, that's probably why Cat doesn't offend me because her comments are usually formed as jokes. But a great deal of what the writers do is not write their opinions as jokes...i.e. Cat's long spiel about "rising up, resist." That was no joke, and it was purely an attack on behalf of a particular female who lost a particular election as of late.


So, again....its all based on perspective. And perspective is a mighty awesome thing. We ALL have different perspectives, ideas, viewpoints. And, I believe that's all MOST of us conservative fans would wish to see...balance of viewpoints.
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Ok, I agree it's my opinion that women's and immigrants rights are being assaulted. My opinion is based on legislation passed and words said.

I will argue based on words and tweets that the President of the United States would in fact limit freedom of the press if he were allowed to do so.

I ask that the argument that liberals would stop watching if the jokes went the other way not be used anymore, that too is an opinion. It is also an opinion to say that should it fit the story the writers won't eluded to the disgusting things Mr Wienstein has done.
Hope, Help and Compassion for all
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Hey, Brierrose...

I can tackle that one for ya. My answer is "yes...." If the writers would simply balance out both sides, I'd be down with it. I'm not against political DISCUSSION. But, indoctrination is a completely different beast. And see? That's why I'm ok when Cat dishes it...because she DOES mock both sides frequently. Political jokes are funny. Talking DOWN to one group, is not.

Example: "No Mr. Speaker, she did not put a bug in your microwave, or your toaster, or your shoooee...." THAT was funny, even though I KNEW they were mocking the President for saying Trump tower had been wire tapped (which by the way, in the Senate hearings they have now revealed that yes...people working out of Trump Towers were, indeed, wire tapped.)

But, the way Cat took the comment about climate change but pushed it too far by insinuating that anyone who simply questions it are "morons." THAT is a bit off putting.

"Right now it's women's and immigrants rights and freedom of the press that are being assaultd by the current administration and all those topics are directy related to the character Supergirl as presented on this show."

Now see, that's an opinion...not a fact. Well, I suppose from ONE side it is seen as fact. And that's a fair OPINION. But, when you see something from a different perspective.....but the other side still states opposition as FACT, it comes across as "talking down" to the opposing view point. See what I mean? And that's become the problem--some people not willing to believe that perhaps...there MIGHT be credence to the "other" side's perspective.
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@jdbop It seems I'm on the opposite side politicaly from you so I'll say this. If the show had taken place during the Clinton scandal I would have been totally cool with a "I did not have sex with that woman" joke and as I said in my last post bring on the Wienstein jabs. Question if they did a Wienstein joke would that make you feel the show is being less "one sided"? Don't assume liberals can dish it but can't take it.

Right now it's women's and immigrants rights and freedom of the press that are being assaultd by the current administration and all those topics are directy related to the character Supergirl as presented on this show. Why doesn't Flash talk about social issues because the main character is a white guy his rights are not threatened. What would you think if Barry and Iris talked about the difficulties inherent in being an interracial couple perhaps as a conversation about thier future children?
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Kiwi: I watch this show religiously. I bought the season 1 DVD even though I have about 1/2 of the season saved on my DVR. The first 12 minutes of the pilot was probably the best 12 minutes of TV I have seen in ten years. I thought Season one was truly outstanding. I would hope this show could go on for years like Arrow or even Smallville, Season 2 and S3e1 have not lived up to the promise/execution of S1 IMHO.
Anyway - the political pot shots are frustrating. As previously noted - Flash does not do political hits and they are doing just fine with the ratings and the story telling. I am sure the feeling of frustration would be the same on the other side if the show hypothetically did a rant against abortion for example and "how anyone who supports it is a murderer and supporting murder" or the like and then continued on with other kinds of diatribes that lampooned/insulted liberal practices/politicians. Supergirl is about female empowerment - do you think they would ever refer to Bill Clinton lying about he "did not have sex with that woman" or how he was disbarred or in future writings make any kind of reference to the current Weinstein fiasco? That would not go over well with the Left. That sort of thing does not belong in the show - about either side. They should just write good scripts, tell good stories and let Kara stop the evil doers.
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To be honest, in the second instance (the speaker thing) I thought it was just Cat being Cat. After all, that is how Cat treated Winn and Kara in the first season. I didn't realise it was a shot at the current US Speaker. It is probable many non-US citizens didn't realise it either. After all, since Earth 38 has a democratic president, why not a democratic Speaker too? I thought the speaker was from Cat's own party to be honest.

I am also pretty sure that the showrunners are going to use Cat Grant in this way throughout the season. Their stance is clear and they seem to enjoy it. While I consider it hamfisted, I don't particularly mind it. After all, their show. They are allowed to have some enjoyment out of it. In some future, historians will watch Supergirl to find out about the politics of the time. :)

As for global warming and such. Guys, I don't understand. It is common practice to take precautions against risks even if people do not know whether something is going to come to pass or not. It may or it may not. Nobody can exactly predict the future and climate systems are complex. However, accounting for it in your rules, regulations and so on, will not harm anyone. After all, people do take an umbrella if they see a cloudy sky, don't they not? If it doesn't rain, the only trouble they had was carrying the umbrella. If they didn't and it rains, they risk falling sick, losing productivity, taking a sick leave....

As they say, prevention is better than cure.

Also... since I took the step anyways....

About alternative energy sources:
If you believe that the earth is billions of years old (some of you in US, may not believe that), you may also believe that carbon cycle is very long--millions of years long. And it is also based on large scale devastation of life such as mass extinctions. Even if not, stuff does empty out in time, so it is only logic that fossil fuels are going to run out in time. If you go by what oil companies say, in around 100 years. Hence, it is also logic to switch to alternative energy source that makes you independent of something that will run out in time. Unless, you want to leave the difficult path to your children and grandchildren.

About hurricanes and sea-level raising: Again, it makes sense to ensure that when structures are built in such areas, they take the potential into account. It saves money in future rebuilding efforts.

About environment: If you dump effluents into streams and rivers, it will pollute them and make them not worthy of drinking. If you have too much carbon or dust, or any industrial matter in the air, it will make the air difficult to breather. It is a fact, is it not? If you were to shut yourself in a room with a fire and no ventilation, you may start to have breathing problems after some time. That is also a fact. Such being the case, what is wrong with reducing pollution? Reducing particulate matter in the air and water? Preventing soil erosion?

About rules and regulations: Most people are not thieves or killers. However, you have rules against stealing, so that you can deter the few who might be tempted. A class action suit was raised against DuPont for working with dangerous chemicals and then dumping waste in the neighbourhood causing harm to people, livestock and environment. The company knew about it but didn't do anything about the issue and continued to dumping hazardous waste in the town for decades. Given options, some corporates and non-corporates will think of their bottom line rather than the long term view of sustainability and social responsibility;especially when the higher-ups are not affected. Having rules and regulations that prevent such acts ensures that the companies are not tempted to destroy people and environment for money.
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I was going to leave this thread alone but I got catcalled twice today, so sorry not sorry I’m going to go off on why entertainment and in particular the only female lead superhero show should talk about social issues which to many people equate to getting political. It so happens that at this point in time one political party in the United States is guilty either by the actions or inactions of its members and leaders of the things on the following list. I feel the exact same way if someone associated with the other party is guilty, bring on the Harvey Weinstein jabs.

TV shows should talk about social issues because;
1) Global warming, even if you don’t believe there are sufficient facts to say human actions are causing changes in Earth’s environment do you really want to take that chance? What’s the worst thing that can happen if global warming is true and no action is taken? What’s the worst thing that can happen if global warming isn’t true but we take action anyway, cleaner air, water, ect.

2) Last July while I was walking down the street with a Latino friend he got harassed by an ICE officer so yep a TV show with a protagonist who is a literal alien refugee should absolutely talk about immigration. Shout out to Cisco’s “bad hombres” line in last night’s Flash episode.

3) The President of the United States has stated on numerous occasions he would like to limit the freedom of the press and calls stories against him to spite the actual facts “fake news” so yes a show with a protagonist who is a reporter should absolutely talk about that.

4) Active users of this site left claiming the show was no longer “family friendly” because Alex came out as gay.

5) Melissa Benoist was ridiculed for her sign at the peaceful women’s march but the man who said the disgusting things she was responding to was elected President of the United States.

6) On the official CW Supergirl Facebook page I got into a discussion with a man who thought the Supergirl suit should include shorts under her skirt because he thought it was “embarrassing” to the character when the skirt flipped up during fights. To his credit after some respectful back and forth and me posting a clip of ice skater Dorothy Hamill doing a spin he conceded my point that the suit is fine as is. Why in 2017 should I even have to explain that a woman can wear whatever she wants and not have to cover her body because men shouldn’t be held responsible for their own behavior?

7) It’s 2017 and people were run over by Nazis and the President of the United States said some of them are “good people” sorry if you are a Nazi or fail to immediately and unequivocally denounce them IMO that precludes you from being a good person. As a Jewish person it terrifies me that these hate groups have been emboldened and the party they claim affiliation with seems to be fine with that.

Whew I feel better, I could on but I won’t. When I feel angry and helpless about the evil things going in my country Supergirl gives me hope and reminds me to keep fighting for what I believe in. Thank you to the admins and everyone on this site for providing a safe space for my little rant.
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I am a very liberal person and I agree with the politics the show usually discusses. Having said that, if they plan to use Cat in this role it is a huge waste of a very talented woman. The jokes and quips they wrote for her were actually so on the nose I didnt find them funny, I wasnt offended by them, but I didnt laugh at all.
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Being Conservative - I do have a problem with the pot shots/insults. The claims made are insulting and the writers should not be pushing their agenda during the show. It is not good business to alienate potentially half of your viewers. For starters - to be so definite in their claim about climate change/global warming and then be so insulting if you disagree with the liberal position is disrespectful. Please note - I am not insulting anyone here - I want facts. There is more than enough statistical evidence to at least question the concept, if not totally debunk it - so the science is definitely not settled. Al Gore famously claimed that the polar ice caps would be gone by now - and they are still around and even growing. The "97% consensus among scientists" claim is just a fancy way of saying it is their opinion. Science is not about consensus - it is about FACT. Even from all the coverage about hurricanes lately, the best forecast can only be a few days out and they constantly refer to the "cone of uncertainty" because they do not know exactly what may happen or where the storm is going.. Just ask Jacksonville about what happened with IRMA. Tampa was supped to be hit but the storm turned against all predictions and went to the east instead of up the coast. EVERYBODY got that wrong. How can anyone seriously claim that they can accurately predict prolong weather changes or what may occur years from now? The one question that global warming "experts" can never answer is... if you are so sure of your facts and science- please tell me EXACTLY when and what will happen. No generalities. FACTS only. Tell me the location, the event(s) and the date of the occurrence(s). When you can do that and it can be PROVEN - I might be willing to listen. Go ....... Until these facts can be presented and proven - no one should be making the claims that the show is pushing. ... There are other issues but you can ponder this post for now.
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I agree with Jtardy's comments, and have no problem with the political stance taken in Supergirl. This dialog is after all based on factual evidence or actual events. IMO it is better to heed the warnings coming from certain conservative senators, the WSJ, George Will, David Frum, David Brooks, and others than fret about a couple of lines of dialog in Supergirl.
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I feel like the show can go a bit too far at times. Regardless of where you stand on the political spectrum, people don't need the writer's own political beliefs shoved in their faces as often as it feels like we see on SG, regardless of whether we share them or not.
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